Jesus Camp Trailer

Heta · Post by **Heta** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 7:57 am

I think the devil killed off god long time ago and is ruling in his place

why else would the world be as it is?

Post by **Lieva** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:07 am

<ankh> wrote:Imo according to Gandelf your not a true christian unless your born again - which means everyone who doesnt submit themself fully to god you will end up in hell rather than heaven. I do know in what way he mean reborn Banana, but there are loads of people who belong to the christian society who doesnt go to church or anything...but they do pay money to the church (taxes that is). So my question now is - even these people help the church, you mean they wont go to heaven? Are you Gods followers or his slaves?

/Ankh

Edit: Im no christian and I don't pay anything to the swedish church either. Not 100% sure if I got the above correct, but in that case - correct me

That's why there is a great chasm of difference between those who say they are "Christian" just because they live in a "Christian" country and those who really are.

gandelf didnt say that at all

he ment that people who say they are christian arnt just cuz they live in a christian country

Would you seriously call a man who goes church then beats his wife up a christian? or the priest who child abuses someone?

they dont follow the basic doctrine yet call themselves christians.

which is why most followers now adays say they are 'born again' simply to be distinguished between these people who claim it and yet do so to gain cash/power etc than those who follow Jesus simply cuz they love him.

Unfortunatly most peoples general oppion can be summed up in two camps

Christian = child abusing priests/wife beating evil guys
Born again christians = the people you saw in the jesus trailer

which is very depressing...
as neither is true

Post by **Lieva** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:08 am

Heta wrote:I think the devil killed off god long time ago and is ruling in his place

why else would the world be as it is?

see you get it

Post by **Xest** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:40 am

Banana wrote:Would you seriously call a man who goes church then beats his wife up a christian? or the priest who child abuses someone?

Yes, all Christians no matter what type are child abusing wife beaters!

Kallima · Post by **Kallima** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:43 am

People seem to be putting some limits on things that I would argue are not necessarily valid, such as the existence of God being subject to proof or disproof by science and only one religion can be true.

If there is a creator then you cannot say that miracles are impossible by the laws of physics, or that physics can disprove his existance. A computer programmer can do and experience things that a computer program cannot (hopefully, though one or two I've met are a bit weird). A creator made the rules of science to run his creation and is not necessarily bound by them since he is outside and transcends his creation.

Given the size and complexity of the Universe then by our standards a creator must be effectively an infinite God far beyond our ability to totally comprehend. The main religions have deep core similarities and could be equally valid though limited views of the same creator and therefore all true.

Even the statement by Jesus that he was the way the truth and the life and no man comes to the Father but by him, could mean he is the intermediary between the creator and humanity and appears in that form in many ways for different religions.

I went to a very interesting funeral jointly conducted by Muslims and Christians that was an example of religion at its best seeking to help rather than be divisive. It was interesting to see how much the faiths had in common.

Are the people who were complaining about no-one using the forum happy yet? <grins>

Heta · Post by **Heta** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:48 am

Banana wrote:see you get it

No, I realy don't. I'm just beeing ironic/sarcastic or what ever it is that I am beeing

Kallima · Post by **Kallima** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:50 am

Xest wrote:Yes, all Christians no matter what type are child abusing wife beaters!

I know child abuse is an emotive subject. Its especially aggravating when someone hypocritically preaches Christianity and does something like that. They may claim they are Christian but given Jesus made some pretty forthright comments on the fate of those who harm children, I would doubt he would acknowledge them as such.

I have a deep hatred of hypocrisy, which is why all the 'adding' debate in RVR annoys me. Hypocrits aside, don't lose sight of the fact professed atheists abuse children too.

Post by **Xest** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:51 am

Kallima wrote:I went to a very interesting funeral jointly conducted by Muslims and Christians that was an example of religion at its best seeking to help rather than be divisive. It was interesting to see how much the faiths had in common.

How did that turn out, child abusing suicide bombers?

Okay okay I'll stop being mean with the stereotypes now

In all seriousness it would be nice if religions worked together more, that's arguably a worthwhile alternative to shedding religion altogether.

<ankh> · Post by **<ankh>** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:01 am

Banana wrote:gandelf didnt say that at all

he ment that people who say they are christian arnt just cuz they live in a christian country

I know loads of people who concider them to be christian and belives in god. But they dont go to church or prey every night.
I do know what he mean - I kind of told you so in the other post and Im pretty sure I can understand it just aswell as you do. According to You and Him you need to be what you concider to be a reborn to be a true christian.

Ankh wrote:which means everyone who doesnt submit themself fully to god you will end up in hell rather than heaven.

You don't seem to get this point. If I don't belive in jesus or if I submit myself as much as Gandelf or You do - according to both of you (i guess) Im not a true christian. Who are you to say who is and who is not a christian? There are loads of various subgroup of christianity who have various views on how a christian should behave and act. If you ask these people, Im sure they will be just as convinced as you are about the "right way" of a christian.

/Ankh

<ankh> · Post by **<ankh>** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:10 am

Banana wrote:Born again christians = the people you saw in the jesus trailer

The people I saw in the trailer are EXACTLY what I was talking about. These people scare me alot. Do you really need to crawl in the dust for God or Jesus to get a spot in heaven? Why does it require a human to yell out how much they love them to be sure they won't be rejected from their kingdom when they die? Imo its more about slavery than freedom. If my son want something, I don't mind him asking for it and I'll give it to him - BUT I would never require him to scream about how much he loves me make him pray to me every night just to get what he want. No offence, but your God is as far from being a nice "person" as You can get.
"If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also" is your jesus supposed to have said - but you God seem to act the other way as he keep on punishing people through out the bible (and apparently he still does as you wont get into heaven if you don't do what he says)... so why does his servants/slaves/followers need to do what he says when he does the opposite himself?

/Ankh